Heroes of Healthcare
Heroes of Healthcare

Episode · 1 year ago

Demystifying Healthcare Recruiting: Finding Heroes

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Every new technology comes with the fear that it will make a job obsolete.

With healthcare recruiting, that fear was sparked by fax, email and internet job boards…

But the news of the recruiter’s demise has been greatly exaggerated.

One need only look to Paul Olzak, Medical Staff Development Officer at Lake Health, to know that this is true. He joins me in the latest Heroes of Healthcare to explain what being a healthcare recruiter means in the modern world.

We discuss:

  • How to attract the best talent in healthcare
  • How recruiter outreach and internet search are evolving in the healthcare talent pool
  • How recruiters help each other succeed

Heroes of Healthcare is hosted by Ted Weyn.

To hear this interview and more like it, subscribe to Heroes of Healthcare on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

Listening on a desktop & can’t see the links? Just search for Heroes of Healthcare in your favorite podcast player.

You're listening to heroes of healthcare, the podcast that highlights bold, selfless professionals in the healthcare industry focused on transforming lives in their communities. Let's get into the show. Welcome to the heroes of healthcare podcast. I'm your host, Ted Wayne. In today's episode we're going to explore how different healthcare systems are able to identify their true heroes, the healthcare professionals who are able to serve in such a heroic way, as we've discussed over the last several weeks in our episodes. So we thought no better place than to find somebody whose job it is is to find heroes. So, needless to say, I'm excited to be joined today by Paul Olzek. With over twenty years focused on Healthcare Business Development and service line performance, Paul has been at the forefront of redefining the traditional inhouse provider recruiting role. In his position as medical staff development officer at Lake Health and Cleveland, Ohio, Paul Integrates Collegial interactions and analytics and provider experience expertise to drive differential recruitment strategies. Paul has a commitment to learning and development and a passion for building a network of recruiting professionals to share practices that benefit organizations and candidates. He's earned an MBA and his CPRP certification. Joining Lake Health and two thousand and fifteen, Paul introduced a proactive recruiting model that generates a robust prospect pool, creates an effective and efficient recruiting experience and identifies metrics to ensure optimal performance. Paul's industry leading insights have really led him to many opportunities and speaking on these strategies, and we're excited to have him joining us here on the podcast. Welcome, Paul. Hey, great to be here. Thank you. I'm excited about today. We're going to talk about something a little bit different but yet related, which is probably a lot more around talent management, right and so I recognize that a lot of healthcare systems are struggling with finding people and getting the right talent in prior to covid and Covid is actually probably put the demand up much higher. So I'm excited to talk to you about the work you're doing at your facility and would love to hear from you just a little bit kind of your philosophy and how you guys approached the talent market right. Sounds like a great way to run this podcast and really look forward to our discussion today. Awesome. So before we jump in, Paul, let's you don't mind, can you give everybody kind of your background and little where you hail from, how did you get into this crazy business, and you know just a little bit more about yourself? Sure, I've been in healthcare of my entire career. What a college and Cleveland Ohio and UNGRADUATES GOING CLEVELAND Ohio and I've been born and raising Cleveland Ohio. I work for one of the smaller health systems here in Cleveland. I'm like every single recruiter that is in the market today, which is our backgrounds are hindes fifty seven. Think we'd be challenged to find recruiter as the same background. We all commend from different walks of life. My background is really focused more on business development, the skills I brought to the table in terms of recruiting or my abilities to converse with physicians and really understand the big picture in terms of, you know, how the physician recruiting impacts the service lines and the Organization of the patient population which it serves. And you know, we can go by different titles, but at the end of the day I'm always referred to and I think all my colleagues are referred to the same way as hey, we'll just have you talk to the recruiter. Let's see what we can do here. Or you get a call that says from an outside source. I understand you're the recruiter for the hell system and you know, can we have a minute to chat? So that's that's how I got here. So your Cleveland Rocks, Cleveland Hall of Fame Guy. Been Lifetime there. I am, I guess. So we took we like talking. We like talking baseball on this podcast sometimes too, as we did on one of our previous episodes. So Am I right? Are the Indians changing the name? Are they staying Indians? The Indians of Nast they are going to change their name. They have not told us what that name change is going to be. Well, I think we're unique too, because we had a football team that left town and then came back actually as a new team. So well, everyone says Cleveland is unique, right. So yeah, well,...

...that's right. So we digress. So let's get back into the talent conversation. Here a little bit. So talk to me about some of the practices that your facility has done in terms of how do you track those we like to call them superheroes, of the heroes of healthcare on this podcast. But how pre covid were you attracting the talent? What resources did you tap into? How did you being a smaller system? Sometimes my might have been to your advantage, sometimes it might have been to disadvantage to get the people in. But what was kind of the overarching philosophy of how do we get the right talent into the organization? Oh sure, so I came to like health in two thousand and fifteen and looked at our process and realized there are two fundamental parts that were missing. One was we didn't have a forward looking recruitment plan that was very dynamic. It's very static. The second thing was is that I'm chiep medical officer of the hell system overall. said that he just was tired of just having a one candidate to choose from. So his goal was to me was what can we do about that? And I made a promise to him that we would have two candidates for every open position and I believe firmly believe that goal setting and having those targets is a way to really dry performance and looking at those two things based on, you know, my background, knowing that we had to have a living, breathing recruiting plan, we were able to really see clearly not only twelve months forward but even three years down the road, you know, based on what we knew about our medical staff. And you know, I sat down with the senior bevp of business development who I report to, and and then our chief medical officer and and I asked them really just off the top of their head, what they thought about our medical staff and in terms of who is going to be retiring, who was staying where. We thought we were going to see some growth in the future. And you know, great story is about a year later, when we got together our chief medical officer and in our Seniorvp of Business Development said to me, wow, I can't believe how much of what we thought was going to happen in the next twelve months really did happen. And so, you know, I really firmly believe that every healthcare system has a lot of data that they just might not know they have, and it goes everything from personal experience and individual knowledge to information that's been collected but it's just never been utilized. So really that's that's kind of how we haven't looked back and that's how we approach our recruiting. Is Very methodical in terms of knowing where our needs, our demands could be, because one of the things that that's well known is that it's possible that there's a great strategy for a business line, but it's difficult to make that strategy hit its particular timeline for implementation because the one component, the the physician, is not able to be brought into that process. We're into that service line is quickly as one would hoped for the fact that different specialties have different recruiting timelines and that's that's really important to know that and one of the things that you know, as recruiters in healthcare, we we really like to be involved in the strategy discussions for the fact that, you know, the different specialties have those different lead times and you know, I think we're all committed to making sure our organizations have just an amazing opportunity to perform and to be able to serve our patient population interesting. So that's and again it's funny aspect I guess you know, normally may not think about but if I understand what you're saying, is so somebody, if you're recruiting for a physician who is maybe cardiology or surgery versus primary care or emergency versus anesthesiology, there is a different lead time related to the specialty. And is that just the simple supply and demand situation or what impacts that delay or those different timelines? Yes, plant a man, absolutely, yeah, and your spot on. That's exactly what it is. So certain ones are easier to just pull the people in for, but obviously, as you said, it also as an implication to the whole business line because it's an aspect of the continue to keep the engine going for that line is making sure that you have the right talent. So in your years and your experience over the last, I guess you know, five or six years where you currently are, what are some of the bigger changes you've seen? What has changed? HAS ANYTHING CHANGED? Is it really still block and tackle recruiting, or have certain things changed in your approach to finding the right talent for the system?...

It's a great question. Yeah, that's the exciting part about recruiting is the fact that there's a lot of changes that had occurred prior to covid and the covid was a whole new animal. But let's talk about things prior to covid. Yes, so you ask me in the last question a little bit about, you know, our approaching and one of the things I would like to touch on is that there are software platforms available to us as recruiters. I mean, I'm not committed to any of these in terms of any kind of sponsorship or anything, but we do use to them. We do use two of the more popular ones, which is practice match and practice link, and I think if you find it, you if you serve a curtis across the country, they're going to be on probably on one or the other. The reason I bring that up is because when I first started I didn't know anything. I didn't know anything like I knew a lot about healthcare, knew a lot about service lines. I all the bits and pieces and really in my business development roles I was always the recipe be and of the recruiting of the physician. So when I got to like health I was like, yeah, I I have no idea how physicians look for jobs. I just didn't know so I went in this crash. Course, it's been a lot of time talking to my peers and also went around and talk to some of the positions we had newly hired and just asked them what their experience was and really got a very good understanding and a short period of time how this happened. And so, using the software platforms, than really able to understand how the process worked for a position looking for a job. Well, I also, though, had spend some time with some recruits had been in the business for a long time and we've always experiences in our lives, whether it is with right now, how we how we used to go to the mall and now we go to Amazon, how we buy online, how we used to go places. Well, there's there was a lot of lamenting about the Morn. There's a lot of lamenting about the fact that these things called career fares were just super popular and you could go to these physically and meet in person candidates who are looking and it was really just a great way to recruit. Well, it was always the conversation. Well, it used to be like this, it used to be like this, and I think in two thousand and fifteen we found ourselveves kind of in a law where recruiting had moved away from that in person touching and being able to relate to each other in person and versus what we were moving toward as a society, which is more online, more removed. And so, from my perspective, I thought to myself, wow, the best way to get a touch with people is through email ailing, and we set out on a pretty aggressive emailing campaign and a strategy to be able to connect and that worked out extremely well for us and really had and I had had the opportunity to talk nationally about what our strategy was at our national meetings and at some meetings with other organizations. But the point is is that what happened was at some point in time the emailing became everybody was doing it, and then the candid started to check out on that and the trend we started to see was that positions were coming into our our process, and this had been something that I've talked to my colleagues for the country to and they're seeing the same thing, is that there was this movement with a physicians to Google jobs and to be more autonomous in terms of how they were looking for their for their future roles. Just stop there for one second. When you say and I think I understand what you mean, but just in case I'm not clear, just for these listening when you say Google jobs, do you literally mean went into a search and said cardiologist and just hit Google and hit return and and try to see what Google came up with? Or my being too general? Know you're being spot on. Okay, yeah, maybe Google is not the best word to use. Maybe it's more of an Internet search, using the Internet to search. Yeah, but simply instead of standing there and saying I don't know what to do or where to look now, I had this thing called Google and the Internet and I could just type in, you know, cardiologist jobs, emergency room jobs, whatever was, and also and I was getting information that would lead me down a path. That's correct. Yeah, and I know that because we're attracting all our sourcing and we're seeing a shift in terms of physicians who were responding to our job postings and they were not connected to our emailing campaign. They were now connected...

...through our job posting and the only way we knew that they were finding that job posting as we knew that it was an internet search. There it's no other way they could have been connected to it. So they weren't coming to you necessarily just through an organic search. What heightened that attraction was the email. So it was the it was the connection of the email to the posting on the website that was making it more effective. It was the Internet search that was driving awareness of our job posting. Got It. So it wasn't the email. The email wasn't necessarily helping. It was literally just the organic search. Correct, got it. Okay, interesting. Right. And like, as you said, everybody started emailing, so that we started to become less effective because you were now just one of the many. That's correct. Yes, and I am the past president of how network of position recruiters. At our statewide meetings we had interviewed physicians on a position panel, residents and fellows generally looking for a job, and we brought them into our twoday event and it was an amazing opportunity for us to ask them questions on a panel and for those and them to ask US questions. And one of the things was is consistently they would say wow, we felt like rock stars for about six weeks when we started looking for a job and really going to start our career and we got in a data with so much email and calls and a number of ways to get in touch with us that we just kind of checked out because started to become interrupted to our work day and it we really just didn't feel like we were that special anymore. And definitely seeing a lot of physicians who are going through the Internet search to be able to identify opportunities before they really want to surface and connect and kind of give up their information. Okay, so interesting. So again just to echo back, so it sounds like what. Yeah, what you were hearing was I don't want to drink my words, I don't want to drink from the fire hose and get all of these jobs coming into my inbox and and five hundred calls. I want to be able to start to go out and look organically search and try to then be more of a sniper rifle versus the shotgun approach to identifying my next opportunity. Is what feedback you were getting from the panels correct and also try. I've been tracking our data. Says two thousand and sixty eight even hear to date and we've seen a shift for sure. Internet search, as we refer to it, or contact the recruiter directly has just continued to climb over the years. Direct email campaign efficiency in terms of the effectiveness as to cline, studily o since two thousand and sixteen. And the professional referrals are actually on the rise. And what I mean by that it's not paid referral from a position. It's just that we get connected from an attending or a friend of a physicians who says, Hey, I have somebody who's interested in a roll at your organization, and that's been on the rise and that has been a huge change. During the covid a pandemic, we have seen that the referral up, way up. Yeah, okay, so let's let's pause on this topic for a minute because this is great. We have a lot of listeners and are why I was excited to have you on, Paul, who are in talent management part of healthcare, right. So we have lots of our audience are in recruiting a JR and listen, for whatever it's worth, even is we know all of the executives of that. We have the CMOS on the call. They're always looking for better talent as well. So we're always looking for the right talent. And trying to upgrade and top grade our team. But this part is really interesting to me because it's something we've been talking about here. I think it was staffing industry analysts a couple of years ago put out a report and said, of all the ways organizations are finding physicians, the largest way they're finding their new job, especially around locum tenants, the temporary side of doing physician work. It was coming from referral. So you had all these other things that made up seventy percent, a lot of it, which was the majority, but it was a lot of little things. And then thirty percent was referral. Right. So obviously the providers were saying I'm finding my next job or I'm finding my next locum's assignment, whichever one it is. Thirty of percent of its coming by referral. And so if you guys are seeing that spike, how do you say, how...

...do we leverage that? So I have that data point. They're talking to each other, one doctor saying to the other doctor, I know of a job over here or you should consider going here. So what are some of the things that you at your group have done or are doing to leverage that? How do you how do you take advantage of that fact that data pot great question. So the started almost three years ago and we were looking for a palmnology critical care physician to join a private practice. So at Lake Health we have private practice physicians and also employed physicians. At our organization. About eighty five percent of our primary care physicians are all employed. About Eighty five percent of all of our specialists are independent private practice. That works out really well. It's a great dynamic. It's been very good to us. So one of the challenges, though, is, and I am responsible for helping recruiting for both private practice and for employed positions. It's what our challenge is. Three years ago was with Prom in art critical care and the group that was recruiting wanted to improve their physician compliment by one and we were doing the typical process on my end, looking, posting a role, emailing, doing a number of things and we just weren't really getting the prospect pool that that I was expecting. And senior partner in the private practice. He is awesome. He's a just a very personable guy, very just very business oriented and very much key role in terms of managing our promonology critical care service line at Lake Health and he's all in. He said, you know, Paul, whatever you think we need to do here, I'll do it and I love working with them. And I said to him, you know, I think that it would be best that if you are walking through the hospital and walking into the physician lounges and spending time out in in the organization, that you don't say, Hey, I'm looking for a partner. Do you know anybody, because that's kind of a conversation killer. But when people ask you, hey, how's it going, just say it's great, we want to grow our practice, we're just looking for partner and you know that's just kind of not going as fast as we'd like and if you know of anybody, just let him know. And that was the first time we did that and in fact that produced more prospects in terms of positions we could talk to and eventually ended up finding his partner that way, and it was a local guy who's working at one of the larger house systems who just wanted to change and was looking more for an opportunity to have more control and to have a smaller practice. And he came over and he's been here and is he's happy as could be. But the point is is that that was our first for a into understanding that just letting your colleagues know that you're looking all of a sudden starts starts that those wheels turn. And we actually found this promonody care physician through nephrologists or nephrologist knew somebody who knew somebody who turned us on to, you know, Dr Fabian is is who came on board. So the point is is at that opportunity for me, and I use that all the time now, and so that just became part of our strategy. So what would happen is I would meet with the practice and say, you know, this is the data that I'm seeing and I know this is where it's going. So please, when you're when you're out and talking about what your future is, don't hold back. You let your colleagues know you're excited, you want to grow your practice or you're looking for another partner or maybe somebody in your practice is retiring and and you looking for somebody and just see how that that turns out. Yeah, so I love that. So obviously right. It's about looking forward. Right exactly. And what I think is so ironic about this and you know, being thirty plus years and staffing and you know my career as well. It's been very funny to me that I remember and I'm dating my say. I kind of joke I date myself. I say I'm Pre Internet, I'm pre facts, I'm pret email, but I remember being in the staffing world and the fax machine came out and everybody said that's going to be the end of us because everyone's going to be able to fax their resume right to the human resources department. Nobody's going to need the staffing companies. You know, it's totally going to disintermediate the business PS. Every Hick staffing company in the country had a fax machine next week and they were all using it to their advantage, right right. And then Monstercom came out, the...

...job board. The Internet was now becoming prolific and job boards come out and they all said, oh, monsters going to be the end of us. Now the clients can go directly on to the onto the Internet, and they can find all the candidates they want. PS, the job boards biggest customers of the staffing industry because they're using it all. They're using it to leverage the ability to bring the services to the client. And now we're hearing about all the ATS systems, they applicant tracking systems and the systems. Now we're using AI, so we're going to use artificial intelligence to process well these candidates coming through, so you're only getting the best candidates, and that's the new disruptor ps to the story what you just said. It is still comes down to having a relationship with individuals and networking. That's correct. Right, it's yes, and the thing is is I don't say that industry was wrong to be concerned about this, because look what happened to the travel industry, right. We used to have travel agencies, used to have to go down and get your tickets printed, and you know, all of that sort of stuff, and now it's all gone online, expedia and Kayak and Deltacom and everything's all you know, you don't need and the travel agent is become something of the past around, but in different ways, but clearly the Internet was a major disintermediator to that industry. But yet in the staffing world, as you said, it's still coming down, to the end of the day, having a conversation, feeling a connection and having a relationship with the people, and this is why I think it's so important for the recruiters who listen to this podcast to know you got to develop that relationship, you got to develop that pipeline, you got to develop the connection with the individual. If you're just doing a to your point earlier, an email blast and hoping that somebody's going to come back to you, your chances of being successful are greatly diminished. Or is, I like to say, hopes not a strategy? Right, exactly. Yeah, there's a lot of talks still today about recruitment marketing and I absolutely believe in that a hundred percent. I believe that what we're seeing is just a reflection of what each and every one of us do in our own personal life. Of question to you and everybody's listening is like, how many things do you buy today off the Internet that you don't look at the re views before you buy? HMM, it's all become about reviews. I mean, right, why do you think all these companies are asking you to review the product? Because they know that's going to lead to more sales. Right, and that's and that's what we're seeing here. For the fact that, again, everyone who's listening to this podcast knows that physicians I have the best relationships with and there's this brotherhood of trust that is between physicians because they have all gone through the same experience. And when I found here at our organization is that our most successful opportunities to have a physician except a role here at our organization is when our physicians are chief medical officer, whoever it is. But there's that peer to peer connection and it's their ability to seal the deal. HMM. I mean, I can tell you personally, I can't take credit for any one of the physicians that we've recruited our organization over his last almost six years, because it's a team effort. It is absolutely a team effort and the physicians play a huge role in that and getting them connected and to be able to have them speak to each other and to talk their talk and their own nomenclature about their roles, but more importantly than to be able to talk about everything from school systems to the community to the culture of the organization. And that just seals the deal. And that's why the sourcing piece of what we do here is is where, I believe, across the country, for anybody who's in healthcare and physician recruiting. It's about the pool because it is a numbers game, because at the end of the day, really the the prospect of Canada, if you will, once they really get engaged, I to they're going to be looking for fit, they're going to be looking for how is this going to be for me and my family and Howard things going to really pan out for me for my career? And you mentioned it before, right. So you got this Ai. That right. That's on them on the horizon today, or maybe even in play today.

You can look at all that data that you want, and I get that right. I mean, you definitely need to go to med school and have, you know, training into subspecialty or the speciality which you're applying for, but it's not the be all end all. It's those intangibles. Yeah, no, I agree. I think it's the it's the AI provides a value or any sort of Algrhythm to bring the most relevant data to your pool. Right. So what? It narrows it down instead of having a dial through five hundred names of people who might write a cardiologist in the Ohio market. Right, it pulls it down to it pulls it down, but at is what you're saying, and I agree, is at the end of the day it's a relationship, it's an emotional by and I think that's the key. You know, to me in life there's not a lot of emotional purchases we make, but I've always said the university I'm going to attend is an emotional by, the home I'm going to buy is an emotional by, the car is an emotional buy, and we certainly know advertising, and I know your you love cars, so you know they advertime world has really created all personas around that personality and what and what buys. I've actually even heard recruiters ask the question to candidates if you are a car, what kind of car would you be? And that because they feel that the personas around automobiles are so clear that their identification with an automobile clearly tells you how they see themselves. So I think that's the very interesting and the other one is our careers, and the career is a purchase. We don't think of it because it's not necessarily an exchange of money to get it, but it is. It's an emotional decision and there's not many of them in life that we do. So to just narrow it down to say ai will tell me who is the right person. At the end of the day it becomes a relationship. It's my relationship, is the recruiter to you, Paul, the candidate. That helps make that thing and, as you said, within the health system it's everybody's responsibility because you're creating that emotional connection. Yeah, you know, I I two colleagues around the State Ohio who had shared some success stories with me and they both had as a similar vein to the story, which was they had worked their magic with the candidates and had gotten them to a point as where they made an offer and there are thinking that maybe the candidate was or was not going to come to their health system. What was an Acriccanton, what was in southern Ohio, two different markets, and at the bottom line is that both recruiting efforts ended up with the physicians getting involved in a very possive way, connecting one candidates spouse to the community lead years and being able to connect them to the passion of their interest, to what was happening in that community and that help seal the deal. And another one was simply just an outpouring of the leadership the physician partners and community leaders just being able to come together and really spend time with the cannon as family and and they were able to land that Canada as well. But the point is is that, again, it feeds right into what you were saying, which is simply wasn't about the job. It was about the job and the opportunities for the for the family to be comfortable with the job opportunity. Yeah, yeah, so when you're recruiting you have to take all those things into into consideration. It's not just about the the quick match or the quick fix. So right, that's great. Let's talk about a little bit while we still have some time here, regarding, since it's kind of the world I come from, and some things about the use of external resources. So you talked about, you know, putting out referrals and creating referral campaigns and the postings on your job boards, and that's and that's kind of that direct one to one relationship. But what are you hearing from some of the groups that you work with who use outside services and what are some of the keys to utilizing a staffing resource to help you identify the right talent? Sure, yeah, I mean at the end of the day. Right. We as recruiters, you know, we want to be able to be a contributing part to or organization and want,...

...you know, to be known as somebody who could really make things happen, and we talked about this little earlier. There are definitely some specialties were supplying to man is is really backwards. You know, there's not much supplying, there's a ton of demand. And what I find is both in our national platform and also on our local platforms, is there's a lot of conversations about outside resources. Who's using outside resources? Do you know any outside organizations that you've had a good experience with? If so, who are they? Let's talk offline or I've seen threads chats where people are asking, Hey, have you ever worked with this organization? And then that conversation is taken offline. So we realize again that we know it's a team effort. You know, it's sometimes we had we go outside because we feel that we need the extra horsepower that an outside organization may have. Access to a pool are we talked about this earlier. Right in source right of prospects, who may become candidates, who may become employed physicians. The the point is is that we will use them, but it's about the relationship with that organization. It's important to us to have an organization that's efficient, that's easy to work with. But more importantly, and I think this is one of the things that I feel like how the physicians feel, when we're all the recruiters are all asking for their time and attention, we're finding the same thing in the industry is that we get a lot of emails and a lot of telephone calls from staffing agencies, permanent locums, whatever it may be, all the time. I'm like, we get them every day and sometimes more than you care and and we all we all ready we all respect that. We're fine. We find that, you know, if we had a need, we'd be reaching out, and if we had a need and we were reaching out. I just mentioned that, how we were going to do it and and really how we do it. And I think what I love about the recruiting world is even if we're in the same state, very altruistic mindset that recruiters have, I might be in competition with somebody but in the same respect we all want to be successful and it as long as you're about, you know hundred and two hundred miles apart, or nationally even it's even better. People will show strategies with you, what will share information with you. They don't care because they know you're not in competition with each other, because we all know the physicians when they're looking for a role, ninety percent of time it's about location. So somebody in Dallas is not competing with me. Now we're going to happen. But the point is is that is that we talk right. So we're getting we're getting these phone calls and emails from from outside sources that we're not going to react to, that we're we actually have this process that we all agree to, which is we're going to ask our peers. Back to right. We're looking at the reviews when we buy our products. We're doing the same thing. Now we're taking our everyday life experiences and now we're moving more toward I'm going to ask my colleagues who they've worked with. Have they had a good experience with our organization and did they help you out? And that's just and again it back to the relationship. Becomes a relationship business. I know somebody has a relationship with you. You had a good relationship with them. Therefore, I like my colleague. I trust them. Therefore, I'm going to call you, Tet, I'm not going to call Jim, you know what I mean, or Dianne. Sure, right. So, yeah, you're going to say to somebody, Hey, you know, I need somebody to help me out in either this specialty or somebody who've you used before that you like. They're going to say, Hey, call Mary over at XYZ staff and company. She's been a rock star for us. And that's how you're going to do it. You're not going to necessarily just go into your voicemail and say, well, who's the last person who called me and I'll give them a try. You're going to want to have and that's the power of that reference. As you're saying, we're the change in our society. Is How many stars? Right? Does it have? Four stars, a five stars? You know, it's yelled I'm in a new town, I don't know where to eat, I go to Yelp and I'm not picking. I'm not picking the two star place to go eat. I'm picking on the five star place. Right, right, yeah, it's the same thing. Okay, now, but I have to comment. When we would go to these national shows and are statewide events, when we met vendors in person. That that was a big thing, to be able to meet people in person. Sure, and my experiences have been when I have met vendors who have...

...actually taken some time with me and we didn't talk business at all, it was a better relationship builder than it was when we talked business, for the fact that they know what I do, I know what they did. We didn't have to. We didn't have to talk about business, right, but it was that part of it that really was important was, you know, just liking the person. Yeah, well, again it comes back to that relationship. I love one of the stories you shared with me, which was, you know, you guys don't use external services. Is Very often you've been able to build this engine, I'll call it, which is helps feed you guys and, you know, keeps your selfsourcing your candidates. You are recruitment organization. Therefore, that's the job they've hired you to do, right, I laugh sometimes with some companies and they have these big recruitment organizations and yet they use thousands and thousands of millions of dollars with external resources. It's kind of like, well, don't shouldn't have one or the other, but that's a different yeah, that's a different thing. But you know the story you shared with me, which was that the way I'll put it is the companies who call you and are just interested in the transaction are not the ones you remember per se. It's the companies who call you, going back to this relationship part, who are just calling to say hey, I'm just checking in. That's true. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I've been experience with one welcome Toennis company that their rep just calls and she's out of Georgia. She just cause and say hey, how's it going like? I just want to let you know I'm here and if there's anything that comes up that you need, you know, let me know and we can see if we can help you out. And we talked about the weather, we just talked about how things are going and I've never met her in person, but she's just got a great phone presence and she started out the relationship simply just saying I just want you to know that who I am and I'm available and if you ever need us, you know think of me and and it's just nice to get a call from right if I'm how babb to pick up. I'll pick up and I'll talk to her right. Yeah, so it continues to reinforce that point. So as we're starting to kind of come up against some time here, let's just the the last part I think I just love for you to talk about maybe is kind of it's kind of we're what's that story that kind of sticks out in your mind that you say remembered? I remembered we got this individual or it was a tough hire or was able to do and you just saw them kind of move the needle in terms of the impact to the organization or you know, it just one of those things. Like I said, you know the theme of our thing is those heroes of healthcare, and I love the angle we took in talking with you, because you guys are are out finding the heroes, you're identifying those individuals. And what's that thing when you kind of you, you know, is there one story or the thing that sticks in your mind that said, hey, we got that individual in here and I just heard this story. I heard they just did this or something, and you know, man, we're having a small part, but impacting the health system. Oh well, that's a that's a great question. You know, I do have. I do a story, though I think that that it's a little bit of a twist on what you ask, but maybe this will help. I put you on the spot. So it's okay. That's okay. We all talk and the industry and we know that about ninety percent of all of our hires are actually driven by location P preference, usually as family ties and and I can tell you, I can I can answer this with more generally speaking, I've had a number of physicians who have come into ourganization over the last five or six years who have contributed significantly to our organization and really have made us an attractive place to work. And it's a compounding effect. We have dynamic, well trained positions who in our organization. Our culture is the Lexus automobile on the the parking lots about is complicated as and is high end as you're going to get. Our physicians are very word community based hospital system to medical centers. We serve about five Hundredzero people, but our physicians are more grounded in there and they're more about being part of the community right. So it's not a lot of look at me kind of stuff and a lot of them are very they contribute to our organizations significantly, they engage the community and they really are just part of and all they want to do is serve the patient population and it's just fantastic. But the one, one one I want to talk about, though, is...

...just the one recently that we fired a general surgeon and in our case here, general surgery is pretty straightforward in terms of filling the roles. It's not one of those hot hard to get specialties. The greatest part about the story, though, is that he is from Sitka, Alaska. Wow, and said Alaska, if you know, is one of the there's a romantic comedy movie with Santa Bullock and Ryan Reynolds and it was based in Sid Alaska and you know, if you're into that kind of in the movie it's funny. Yeah, and if you see what's it go Alaska looks like, you'll be like, how did this guy end up coming to Cleveland? Well, the the Cleveland connection with such said he had done training all over the country and he was finishing up his training in Arizona. So Arizona and said go Alaska couldn't be any different, right. We're talking that a lot of grass and a lot of green and trees to snow up in Alaska and he connected with us, or the fact that he had an underlying passion for sailing. And you guys have you be on the lake. We Have Lake Erie. One of the criticisms of the Lake Erie is that it gets very rough because it's shallow. What we're on the side of all the Great Lakes where we and buffalo off of Lake Erie just get hammered with snow in the winter time because the winds blow into our shoreline, while it makes for great sailing. And I just happen to grow up with friend of mine WHO's family had a sailboat and I had been sailing on Lake Erie, was very familiar with this sailing culture and and so I was able to have like a sailing conversation with this candidate. And low behold, he can't. And the other thing was is that I got him up here in July, well, July, and Cleveland is spectacular. It's greener than green could be right. It is just amazing, beautiful, comfortable weather up here. And that was it and he took the role and he's here. But but I saw him in November and he said to me, Ha you really got me up here in a really nice time of a year, because Cleveland gets very gray and that lacks a lot of color in the wintertime and sailing doesn't happen. So yeah, no, but I love that story because again it goes back to clearly what was the theme that ran through today's conversation, which is it comes down to meeting them where they are, meeting the candidates and speaking to their passions, speaking to their families, making sure that it's got to be an emotional connection it. It's not just it's not just an Amazon transaction. Right, right, right. Yeah, and he has no familier. Why is this? Is Purely that you know that ten percent of the people who just go somewhere to live and work because they have a reason for it. So yeah, that I love that. So just to kind of recap as we're as we're wrapping up here, I kind of I wrote down from notes and you know, kind of the three big takeaways that I had and you know, by all means you know, please add if I missed anything. But one let day to drive your activities right. So you're looking at the data to see where are they coming from? The emails used to work. Now they don't work. There's a ship, you know, and all that. So let the data drive your activities. Yes, point you where to go. Referrals are still king, so we can still do a lot of things, but at the end of the day it's referrals are still still still king in terms of finding the right the hero talent in the physician and the healthcare world. And it's still about relationships and it's an emotional purchase. At the end of the day, it's going to be it's the connection to the city, it's the connection to the community. It's those things that are going to really what helps you drive finding the right talent in the right market. Yes, great, awesome. Well, Paul, this has been fun. You know, I have to always end the all my episodes with the question that I'll pose to you, which is, thinking back in your days, young or old, who, who was your hero? Oh, sure, I have a lot of respect for individuals who stories are about building career, creating opportunities that are aren't actually straightforward, and there's a number of people out there. You know, Sam Walton, Jack Welsh from Gee, Jeff bezos. Actually, great story...

...there, HMM, but one of the ones that I really really like is is Tom Brady the quarterback in the NFL. And and it's not because he won seven super bowls. Right. A lot of people go right to that. One of the things, though, is in Cleveland our team left and then went to Baltimore and and in that and that a few years where they were in here. I needed to find a football team that I could follow and I didn't want to follow a team from a city. So I felt that New England just happened to be pretty generic and it represented an area and I chose that. Low and behold. I had no idea the fact that Tom Brady and bill belichicker going to hook up and create the dynasty that they did. But the reason I bring this up is because Tom Brady talks about this himself and it's a lot of people may or may not know this, but you know, when he was drafted as the a hundred ninety nine player in the two thousand NFL draft, I have some notes here about his his combine comments was he can't throw a tight spiral, he lacks a strong army, lacks ability to avoid the rush and and right now the guys got ninety one. Tho career passing yards and six hundred and sixty four touchdown passes. You know, they had talked about the fact that he gets down easily, he can't drive the ball down field and and today he's in his twenty eight first season of the NFL. He's never had a losing season his creser career leader in an NFL for quarterback with most wins, quarterback with the most playoff wins, this most super bowl MVP's and he's won super bowls over three decades or thirty years. It's unbelievable. Yeah, and the reason that is the reason that I like Tom is because it's an epic failure for the scouts to they missed his intangibles. Yeah, and is intangible, as I smart. He's disciplined, he's got an exceptional work ethic and he understand what it takes to get the team to perform. And the fact that that is that, that's that's the part about his story is because, while I could read about these other people that I mentioned prior to Tom I actually watched him work, his philosophy and his passion and, is it, his discipline for the game. I watched that unfold year after year after year and you can see now, after all these years, how that just played out and I think that for me, I think is a great example to me, my two daughters, people that I you know, anybody really is that he was absolutely not even on the radar screen, you know, being drafted in the NFL and and here, you know, it's all this discipline, on hard work and really all that he's done and he's never lost focus in terms of the fact that you just got to stay on top of your game every day. And so, you know, that's a good example to me and you know, if I'm going to do something on a daily basis, you know, just practice what I want to have happen and it should happen that way. Yeah, yeah, no doubt. Whether you love them or you hate you can you can't deny the who you know who he is and what he's done. And know you're writing. Have to have admiration for the fact that manning had a great career, but he was a top pick and you know, and and all and all that sort of stuff, and Tom was nobody. That's I also love in baseball. That was the old Mike Piazza story, right. He was a oh yeah, he was a draft pick as a favorite to Tom Lasorda, who is his godfather and you know, went on to the hall of fame, right. So you always loved that. Everybody, as this, as a saying goes, everybody loves a comeback story, right. And so yeah, I appreciate that, Paul, and I love that about that's a great one. And and and no doubt again, love them or Hatum, you can't deny that who he is. So that's great. Well, Paul, thanks for spending some time with us. It's been a pleasure. It's been great taking a little bit of a different approach to our podcast and getting some information, you know, in terms of how do we find those heroes and in everybody's world, I love the fact that you guys and lakeside are so open and share and collaborate with your fellow health systems in Ohio and around the country, and I know you guys share candidates from time to time and even things like that, and obviously that's a that's a great approach to so thanks again for joining us on the hero's healthcare podcast and we look forward to continue to talk with you down the road in the future.

All Right, thanks said, you've been listening to heroes of healthcare for more. Subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player or visit us at heroes of healthcare podcastcom.

In-Stream Audio Search

NEW

Search across all episodes within this podcast

Episodes (40)